Lauren: Hey everyone, welcome back to another episode of Publish & Prosper. Today I am super excited because I'm here with one of my absolute favorite Lulu Authors and creators that I've met over the last few years. And he is somebody that we have referenced many, many times on this podcast as a great example of so many different things, so I thought it was high time that we brought him on the podcast for an actual interview.

[0:49] – Episode Intro

Lauren: Welcome Stephen Cabebe, author of Disney Ready, which I am obviously biased about.

Stephen: Lauren, thanks for having me. Seriously, it's an honor to be here, talking to you about everything. Everything that has conspired through Lulu and everything that has come through here. So.

Lauren: I mean –

Stephen: Appreciate it.

Lauren: – it's an honor to have you on here. I really do feel like I use your book as a reference, like, all the time.

Stephen: Yeah. I mean, I can't wait to talk a little more about it. The journey to get there and then also the journey afterwards has been a whirlwind. Now knowing that, what, the book came out... was it a year and a half, two years ago now? Like, it's been out for a while, if I remember correctly. But anyhow, it's been, it's been crazy.

Lauren: I mean, time isn't real, so. It could’ve –

Stephen: Yeah.

Lauren: – been last –

Stephen: Ever.

Lauren: – week, or it could have been two years ago, but. It has been out. We both actually have copies. I won't make you reach for yours, but if anyone's watching the video, I have a copy of mine that, that goes perfectly on my shelf with the actual castle that's on the cover. So.

Stephen: I love it. I love that so much.

Lauren: Which actually is a question that I – I'm going to start by going rogue completely. As as somebody who adores the pink castle and is genuinely upset that it's been returned to its gray glory. Are you, have you thought about whether or not you want to update the cover of your book, or are you going to leave it as is?

Stephen: Oh man, you're asking the question I didn't even think you would ask. Oh, God. No, no it's, it's staying. It is staying. I really, really, really like the way this cover was done. Shout out to Tim who who put together this cover. And I think it was his photography as well, Tim Bigonia. But like, I don't know, like, you take a look at this book and it just... every time I look at this book, and I just look at the cover, I'm like... damn. Dang.

Lauren: I completely agree.

Stephen: Like, it’s just, it's so, it's so pretty. It's – so much thought went into just that, that I think it's going to stay. I really think it's going to stay.

Lauren: I mean, I personally, I'm not telling you that you should change it, I love it. I – and I know I'm biased, but I love it. I agree, every time I look at it, I'm like, ooh. Like, I would pick this book up off a shelf –

Stephen: Yeah.

Lauren: – in a bookstore. And, you know.

Stephen: It pops.

Lauren: It absolutely pops. And it admittedly, it's a book that – or it's a cover, rather – that is very, like, only people that are interested in going to Disney are going to gravitate towards this cover, but that's the entire point. You're already speaking to your audience from ten feet away. Great work.

Stephen: Right. And I can imagine that if it, if it had the, the gray, the newer castle, newly painted castle, it would just - it wouldn't pop as well, it wouldn't stick out as well. It wouldn't like, shout out to the people that need it the most. And that's, in the end, that's really what I wanted to do, was help the people that, that need that, that guide the most, right?

Lauren: Which I love it, and I agree, I think that as, as classic as the, the gray, white whatever castle is, it wouldn't pop on the cover like this.

[4:10] – Meet Stephen Cabebe

Lauren: We're already starting to get into all the things that I want to talk about, but I want to make sure that we we take a step back before we get too caught up in there and –

Stephen: Of course.

Lauren: – actually introduce you. So can you tell us or those that are listening a little bit about who you are, what you do?

Stephen: My name is Stephen. I'm a doctor of physical therapy and huge, huge Disney fan, thanks to my wife. I'm originally from California, so a little bit of backstory about how I came to be who I am today. When we were living in California, my wife and I, when we were still just dating at the time, we would go to Disneyland all the time. Like driving from the Bay Area, San Francisco, down to Disneyland once a month –

Lauren: That’s a long drive.

Stephen: – was a – it was a regular thing. Yes, a six hour drive to get there. But it's – if you live in California, and especially if you live in the Bay Area – that's kind of a normal thing. Like you don't really bat an eye or think twice about it. You just do it. So going to Disneyland once a month for a couple days at a time, like, no big deal. It was one of those, my friends and I would like, compete to see how many steps a day we would get at Disney. Like that sort of physical aspect of Disney, no big deal. And when we booked our first trip to Disney World not that long ago, I was like yeah, no big deal. I can do this, it's fine. And after the first trip, day four. I like I, I... not only were, were my feet hurting. My back was bothering me. Like, I ended up falling asleep on Carousel of Progress which is –

Lauren: Understandable.

Stephen: – one of my favorite. Like, yes, but. Like it’s –

Lauren: No no no, I get it. I get it. It is... it's, it's fun, it's compelling. It's a, it's a very charming ride. But it's also you're sitting in the dark in a comfy seat for 20 minutes.

Stephen: Right.

Lauren: It happens to the best of us.

Stephen: And like, it was, like, you're so fatigued in the middle of the day on day four and you're at Magic Kingdom. You're like, oh, these, you know, 40, 50 year old seats aren't as uncomfortable as I thought. They're actually getting a little more plush, right? Anyways, it took like two more trips for me to realize, hey, you know, I don't have to deal with these. This foot pain. This back pain. My feet on fire, falling asleep on attractions that I probably like don't need to fall asleep on. And it was around that time I went through graduate school to get my doctorate in physical therapy. I spent time experimenting, trying different outfits to work with the weather at Disney World. You know, trying different shoes to see what works best for my feet, trying all these things and then tacking on my knowledge as, as a doctor of physical therapy to come up with my own system. Right? My own system to prep for Disney, physically prep for Disney, take care of your body while you're there, and then come home feeling recovered, not wrecked. Right? And once I developed that system for myself, I was like, hey, yeah, I actually I proved to myself, yeah, I, I can do Disney without feeling wrecked. And at that point, you know, I learned that so many other people felt this way. And I was like, well, I need to find a way to share this to other people. And then my mission, that that's when my mission started coming up, or that's when I developed my mission. And here I am today. I, I literally help people physically prep for their next Disney trip so they can walk more, feel stronger in their body, and come home feeling energized, not wrecked. And the book, the book was a big part of there. So yeah, that's what we want to get into. The book was a very big part of getting there.

Lauren: We definitely will. And for everybody listening that is like, oh my God Lauren, can you ever do an episode without talking about Disney? First of all, the answer is no. But second of all, I promise, I promise that we’ll keep the Disney to a minimum. But I think it's an important part of the backstory. Because –

Stephen: Yeah.

Lauren: – I think that even if you just remove Disney from that narrative in general, that is something that is a linear trajectory for a lot of creators. There's this thing that I love or have a special interest in or have a lot of expertise in, and I've spent a lot of time developing for myself, a good way to do this or the right way to do this, or a unique way to do this or whatever. And after a while realized that I'm not the only person that has this, this pain point or has this problem that they're trying to solve. And I think that is something that a lot of people that are listening to, even if they're not specifically talking about Disney, can listen to that and go, oh yeah no, that, that resonates a lot with what I'm trying to do here too. So I think that's a really –

Stephen: Yeah.

Lauren: – important part of the origin story, and a really cool part of it.

Stephen: For sure.

Lauren: Yeah.

[9:02] – Building a Brand and a Business Around Content

Lauren: I also think – and then we'll get to the book, I swear. I think that again, in a way that is relevant to a lot of creators, something your specific expertise, something that you talked about in that story that you just shared, is that you... you were starting to think about, like, not just point A to point B. You know? You've said it in here and I've seen you talking about this, about what clothing you wear, and not just in terms of like wearing comfortable shoes, but like... I've seen you talk about backpacks and bags and, you know, if you're lugging a 20 pound backpack around with you or a 20 pound shoulder bag, tote bag that's pulling your body down in one direction, that is going to have an impact on how you do this. And I think that, again, not the Disney part of that, but the part of that where you're thinking beyond the scope of just how do I not, like, run myself ragged at Disney, but what are all the different pieces that go into that? That is your... your niche, your tilt. Do you say niche or niche?

Stephen: Oh, I say... you'd have to catch me saying it offhand, and I would tell you. I don't know. I'd probably say – I can’t – I don't know.

Lauren: It's okay. I’ll trick you into it later.

Stephen: Yeah. It’s, that's the best way to do it.

Lauren: But, but yeah, you know, I think that is something that, that's where you go from a single piece of content to a, an idea that you can really expand on.

Stephen: Yeah. I mean, to add to that, you know, after deciding that the book was a good avenue to explore the next question and the next like challenge and that came up was, how the heck am I going to write a book? Like, a book makes sense. But how am I, how the heck am I going to do it? And the - it simply boiled down to, like you said, you know, figuring out the process that I want to share, turning that into an outline, and then checking and rechecking whether or not that outline really reflected what I believed, or what I wanted to share with my audience. And then that outline really just becomes the chapters of your book. From there, you write a little bit every day. You just kind of go at it for each chapter and each chapter. Before you know it, you have an entire book. Like it's – the process itself is not as hard as you think. For, you know, content creators out there that are thinking about going down this avenue, it really isn't. Especially if you're the type of content creator that's putting stuff out on, say, on social media. And you want to provide some value in one post. Well, that one post can end up being an entire chapter of a book. And like you mentioned about bags at the parks, it literally is an entire chapter for my book. You know? That's just one post, right? That I'll post –

Lauren: Yeah.

Stephen: – you know, one out of five days of the week. And that's an entire chapter of the book. So, yeah.

Lauren: Yeah. How many different channels do you have that you use? Or like, content delivery methods? Before the book.

Stephen: So everything, everything really started with the blog. And once I started writing on the blog I was like, I should probably get onto social media because I think that's where people are really hanging out. And turns out I was right. And then the more I wrote on the blog, the more I realized that this can become a book. Around the time I was developing the book was when my email newsletter came out. Cause that helped raise awareness for the book, and then also my mission. Around the time the book came out was also when my podcast, Happily Ever Active came out, because it was basically a reflection of the book, a little more in-depth. And then finally after that was when my one-on-one coaching and rehab program came about. So all of those are ways that I deliver my content to my audience.

Lauren: Would you put them all in equal level in terms of like, they're all, they all serve as, as lead magnets? They all serve as different ways to, to connect people into your ecosystem? Or do, like, is there one that funnels into the other that funnels into – like, all roads lead somewhere or something like that?

Stephen: Yeah, really good question. In terms of like blog versus social media versus podcast, like I would all put them kind of on the same level. Because people consume content differently. Some people like blogs, some people like being on social media all the time. Some people like listening to podcasts. So whatever channel they like to go through, I have something for them. From there I want to funnel – I typically want to funnel them into my email newsletter with some sort of free lead magnet. From there, that's when awareness is usually brought up about the book. Usually it's when the book is purchased, is when the conversation goes a little deeper between myself and that person. And if that conversation goes far enough to where they feel like they need a little bit more guidance, that's when the one-on-one coaching comes in.

[14:16] – Using a Print Book to Support His Audience

Lauren: So what made you decide that you wanted a book as a part of this... system, I guess? I mean, I know you just talked through the journey of how that came to life, but like why, why a book, specifically?

Stephen: Yeah, yeah, a really good question. For me, like my, my gut reaction to that question is like there's a tactile sense of having a book in hand, right? Especially when the book really was to serve as a physical guide you can have at the parks. So, information through the internet, looking up things on your phone, it just it sits differently in your mind versus a book. And it easily gets lost in the internet. If you have a book versus something on your phone, having the book is a lot easier to stay focused on the information you want versus being on the phone, where it's really easy to get distracted. So like, not only are you able to focus more, but you're able to comprehend a lot easier when you have that book. And then like, like I said, that tactile thing of just having something in hand, in your bag, easy to grab. You know it's the one thing that serves its one purpose when you're in the parks. I mean like, how many people have you seen walking around Epcot during Food & Wine Festival with their phone out looking at the Disney blog, like the Foodie Guide Disney blog. Versus how many people do you see walking around the park holding the, you know, the pamphlet that they have for Food & Wine? How many people do you see holding that? I don't know about you, but I see way more people holding the pamphlet. Because – everyone's going to say something different, but I think it's because of that tactile sense that I can take out my pen and mark whatever foods I want, and then mark it off when, you know, I've gotten that food. Kind of the same thing with, with the book. So that's where the book comes into play.

Lauren: I mean, the people that listen to this podcast have, have heard Matt and I both say this ad nauseum. I'm a very tactile, physical person. I was looking to see – I don't think I can reach it without knocking things over here – but literally at my feet under, under this bookshelf, is a box that I have maps and like –

Stephen: Yes.

Lauren: – the festival food guides and everything. I, I collect them from every Disney trip that I've been on. Like, I have them back to the 90s. And, and that's exactly what I do. I love carrying them around in my bag, and I pull them out and I check off exactly what I had when I'm eating at, at Food & Wine or whatever. Like that's, I completely agree. I think that is something that is very much part of the experience, and especially for your specific brand and your specific audience. A common complaint that I've heard a lot from people lately is that it is so necessary to be kind of glued to your phone at Disney –

Stephen: Right.

Lauren: – these days, because so much is run through their app and and through, like, virtual queues and, and mobile food ordering and stuff like that. And I think that we all take any excuse to be like oh, something that I can reference like a physical version of it and not be wasting my phone battery and my data and once again on my phone for the 87th time this hour. I think that is exactly, like, what your target audience wants. Specifically.

Stephen: You said it perfectly. It really just enhances the park experience. That, that is what the book is out there to do. So yeah, I love it. I love the way you put it.

Lauren: I'm also now going to continue to project assumptions on you, but I have always assumed that that was an intentional design choice that you made when when you were designing the book. If anyone's not watching or just listening, this is a small paperback. It's a pocket size, like, quite literally could fit in pretty much any bag that I would ever bring to a Disney park with me. It's lightweight. It's not 600 pages. This is something that is very functional for your intended use. Was, was that intentional?

Stephen: Very much so. I – after conversation with Matt before even publishing the book, I mean, we had agreed. Sorry, he had, he had advised and I agreed with him, that the pocket book was the way to go. And after getting that first copy, I was like, yeah, you know what? This totally works. So the pocket book size fits perfectly in – For reference for listeners, the Lululemon crossbody bag? You know, there's like a Disney line of crossbody bags, too. Same size. I have one of those. I can fit two of my books in that, along with my sunscreen, my sunglasses case, some chapstick, and my phone charger, my small phone – like it, it is that small to where I can pack everything I need into my day bag and probably have a little bit more room. So yes, very intentional.

Lauren: Yes. Which I think was a very, very smart move on your part.

Stephen: Yeah.

Lauren: My park bag is a little bigger than that, so rest assured your book will fit in my park bag.

Stephen: Perfect. So yes, there you go. There you go.

Lauren: I try to, I try to evenly distribute the weight though, and I make sure that it's not too heavy. It is a backpack and I do wear it on on both shoulders, even though my millennial heart tells me not to.

Stephen: Make me proud.

Lauren: I try. So what do you think it is other than the, the like tactility of it, that a book can do for your target audience? Or even just like, you know, providing opportunities for you that get you in front of that target audience?

Stephen: One of my current coaching clients had actually found me because she found my book. And she had literally purchased, I think two copies of my book, one for her and then one for her dad. And I sent her an email and I said, hey, thanks for buying the book, I really appreciate your support. And she emailed me about – she, she replied saying like what, what her situation is, when her Disney trip is, how her dad isn't as ready for the Disney Parks as she would like to, so this was a way for her, her to help out her dad. And like, this led to deeper conversations, which led to her starting to work with me. So like, I've had experiences like that, where they literally just go up the value ladder, so to speak. I've also, like I always, always, always have one or two books on hand whenever I go to the Disney Parks, whenever I go to – Like I was at D23, the Ultimate Fan Event, last month, two months ago. Like events like that, going to the parks, allows me to connect to one, my target audience. But two, other content creators, travel agents, people in the Disney space, or the Disney-adjacent space. It's my way of saying hey, you know, this is what I do. This is what I've done. And usually I get the response of, hey, oh my gosh, you've written a book. That's so cool. And then I give them a copy and it's, it's like a, as Lou Mongello kind of told me one time, it's like a glorified business card. But it's perfect because it shows my authority in the space. It shows that I love what I do enough to write a book about it. And then it it has my contact information, so I can connect to people that way. Makes me more memorable. So yeah, a lot has come out of that book. More than just, hey, I sold a book. And it's been, again, like I said, a pretty wild way to think about writing a book that I, I didn't think this was going to happen beforehand. I'll just put it that way.

[22:01] – Marketing a Book and a Business as an Introvert

Lauren: What did you think? What was your goal for the book before you published it, or did you – how did you see it serving a purpose for, for your business or anything?

Stephen: Yeah. Well, so honestly, I think the business kind of came out of the book. Before writing the book, I was very – I still am very introverted, I'm sure people could relate to that. But I didn't want to put myself on camera. I didn't want to talk in front of a bunch of people, let alone people that are on another side of the screen. But I had this knowledge that I knew I needed to, like, get out there, because not many people are talking about how to have a pain free Disney trip. So starting out with a blog which turned into a book seemed like the next logical thing for me to do. So for me it was like, okay, it's a way for me to get my knowledge and mission out there without having to necessarily put my face out there because I feel so introverted. And then on top of that, of course, you know, the goal of being a reference, being, a way to elevate a Disney guest’s experience. And then just a way to establish myself as an authority in the space. Because, again, you know, no one's really out here doing that sort of thing. So let me make sure I'm putting, I'm letting you know that I am there.

Lauren: I mean, I will say I spend a lot of time in the Disney content creator space – for fun, trying to get into it myself. And I think it's very oversaturated. A lot of people find a specific niche and that's great, but it is a very oversaturated area. And I don't know if I've ever come across anybody else that is doing what you're doing in this space. And I think that's really cool. That, that you found this, this very specific lane that you're like, I'm in it and I'm committing to it. So.

Stephen: Yeah.

Lauren: Good job.

Stephen: Appreciate it.

Lauren: I, I do want to ask though, and you can, you can choose not to answer this if you want to. Cause I think that, I think you're right that a lot of people listening, or not listening, can relate to the idea of: I'm an introvert and I don't like putting myself out there in this way, so I'm going to write. That's, that's the, the solution. Whether it's writing a blog, writing a book, whatever. And then you hit that, that point in time where you realize that in order to promote a book, you do have to go out there and put yourself out there. Which is a really, really –

Stephen: Yeah.

Lauren: like, it's like the worst gotcha ever.

Stephen: Yeah. 100%

Lauren: So, and you know, I don't know if you know this, but you're currently on a video podcast. And I've seen you out there on social media and, and doing all like your videos and stuff like that and, and you’re, you're doing the thing that you said you didn't want to do. So... How'd you get there?

Stephen: Stephen, what happened?

Lauren: Stephen!

Stephen: What happened? How did that –

Lauren: But, like, genuinely. I mean, you know, did it, did it become something that like, you're like, okay actually, I do kind of feel like an authority and an expert, and I feel a little, a little more willing to put myself out there. Or is it still something that you're like, oh, this is hard, and I have to force myself to do it every day?

Stephen: I wouldn't say I have to force myself to do it every day, but it certainly still is a challenge, right? My introverted behaviors have been around forever. So like working through and battling that is always an ongoing effort. But I was at a business building event in Nashville a couple weeks ago. And part of this like, twelve hour work-type day, long day, but amazing day. Halfway through we walked out into like a horse field. It's a field where they literally just train horses. And we were like – everyone, everyone that signed up for this conference was like, what are we doing? They never told us what we were going to do. We walked out onto the field and someone was there showing us falconry and different types of falcons, owls, birds. Anyways, part of the experience was holding one of those trainer's gloves and having the falcon fly onto our hand. Really cool thing, right? But there was one falcon they were using that was still kind of new to this whole environment and flying to people's hands, like, that they didn't know. And the, the trainer had said, what we need to do is make sure that their hunger is stronger than the fear of doing the thing. And then that's when it clicked. Like, oh, that's what made me do this, this whole time. I realized, hey, I really want to do this. And not only that, like I, you know, I don't have kids yet, but we want, my wife and I, we do want to start our own family. And the, the deep mission here is I don't – as a doctor of physical therapy, I don't want to get stuck in the health insurance based model of healthcare. I believe that so many other people can get such better level care outside of that. And I also want to raise a family that I can spend time with, not raise a family that I have to leave the house every day and work 80-90 hours a week just to sustain life. So the hunger for what I really wanted overcame the fear of actually doing the thing. Right? How long it took to get there? Clearly it took, you know, a year, year and a half to get there. But here I am, right? And I'm – again, I'm still battling it. But, you know, we've known each other for a while now and things have changed a lot since that first time meeting each other.

Lauren: Yeah. Which I mean, honestly, it's one of my favorite things about connecting with different creators in, in different ways. And watching that trajectory, and watching people go through that and, you know. If the listeners haven't picked up on this yet, Stephen and I met each other at Momentum a couple of years ago, Lou Mongello's event, which is very much an event that that has kind of, a recurring group of people that go. And it was incredible that there were people that I haven't talked to since Momentum last year that came up to me and were like, oh my god hey, I still haven't written my boo.k. But let me show you all the cool things that I've been doing in the meantime! And I'm like, that's awesome. Like yes, I love that you've started this Instagram channel, or that you started doing this thing on YouTube. Or, you know, maybe you're pivoting with the book because the book taught you that you wanted to go in this direction instead on something else. And I think that, that growth and that, like, trial and error effort is so cool. And I love it so much.

[28:56] – Choosing the Right Content for His Book

Lauren: So what... With, with the book specifically, what do you think in terms of like, how you chose to put content in there? Like what what content you chose to put in there? Is there content that you cut out? Is there enough content that you cut out that you decided, oh maybe this will be book two? Or like, how did you go about the process of, of narrowing it into this –

Stephen: Yeah.

Lauren: – this small pocket-sized guide?

Stephen: That's a good – that's a really, really good question. I think we talked about writing out an outline that turned into the chapters of the book. And in writing that outline, for me, I thought about my reader journey. So Disney Ready: Your Pain Free Survival Guide. How to prep your body for Disney, take care of your body while you're there, and then recover so you don't feel wrecked. That is literally the journey of my audience, right? So you're thinking about how to start and do a walking program. How to listen to your body while you're doing that walking program. How to develop a morning and evening routine so you feel refreshed every morning while you're at Disney. Hydration strategies. Outfit ideas for the weather. How to choose your walking shoes. Right? Like all of these things that people sometimes think about or like, they think of bits and pieces, but they typically don't think about everything in depth. And that's where, that's where this like, outline that turned into the book came from. And then I wanted to add, of course, my expertise as a doctor of physical therapy. So that's where that walking plan came in. I ended up including stretches to do before, during, and after parks days. How to tackle rest days, rest breaks. Because one of the biggest – I mean, hint: one of the biggest mistakes people tend to make on rest days is they like, for example, go to Disney Springs. And then they end up walking 15,000 steps while they're there. It's not really a rest day, right? If you're going to plan to go back to Magic Kingdom the next day and walk 25,000 steps. So like thinking of things like that and being very audience-focused so that I make sure to hit what needs to be understood by my audience is what helps guide this whole process. And in terms of like, is there information I cut out? Yes, but only to make my points more succinct. And in an effort to make the points hit home quicker. Will it turn into another book? I'm not sure yet. I'm still thinking about that. But I have other ideas. I'll just, I'll leave it at that.

Lauren: I mean, I have it on good authority that other ideas very quickly lead to eh you know, I’m just opening a Google Doc. Or eh you know, I’m just... We'll see.

Stephen: Google Doc is opened. I think we'll – we'll talk, I think we'll talk about this later. But.

Lauren: Okay.

Stephen: The, the more time I spend working with clients, the better my, my next idea is going to be.

Lauren: Okay.

Stephen: So. Yeah.

Lauren: I'm excited to hear more about that. Austin Church said this when I was talking to him a couple of years ago at CEX. That he, the book that he started writing that he thought was one book was actually three books. But he didn't realize that until he got, like, a good chunk of the way through the first draft of that book and then realized like, oh, I have to take some things out of here. And so, you know, I've talked to people that have said, oh, I started working on my book and I realized that, you know, I wanted to pivot on this and, and turn this particular subject of the book into a YouTube series. And, and then maybe we'll go back to the book, strip that part out of the book and, and go in a different direction there instead. So it does sound like you did something very similar. Did you have like a, a word goal, or a page count in mind? Because I know, like I said, you know, small thin pocket-size. Did you have like a target in mind, or you were just trying to keep it short and sweet and wherever it landed, it landed?

Stephen: Yeah, that's exactly it. Wherever it landed, it landed. I, I think, just like when you’re deciding when, how long to make a podcast, like, as long as you hit the point that you want to hit, then that's enough. And that's really what helped guide me through that. Yeah.

Lauren: Man, it would be really cool if I could just be like: and that's the point. That's it, we're done. That would have been like the perfect button to end this on. Except I have so many more questions.

Stephen: I do have to say my introverted self is like, just get to the point, shut up, and be done. But that's also, like when it comes to writing or when it comes to content creation, I think there's a happy medium between like, talking too little and then talking too much. And I think I'm on like, the end of talking too little. So I do feel like they're – looking back at the book, that there are certain things I'm sure could have gone a little more in-depth. But like you said, you know, taking a chapter, turning it into a video series. Taking my stretches from the book and turning them into videos you can actually watch, with me narrating, that's been done. Taking a chapter and turning it into a podcast episode, that's been done on Happily Ever Active, like. Things like that have definitely happened, where I can talk a little more in-depth on, on things, for people who want to hear that and watch that.

[34:33] – Choosing the Right Format for His Content

Lauren: I would love to talk a little bit more about that, actually. Because I think that's kind of one of the other things about your book specifically that I think is very exemplary of what I would love to tell other creators to do. I think that describing your content to somebody else, a lot of people might respond to that by saying like, oh. I'm not sure that a book is the, the obvious choice for how to deliver this content to people. I mean, like you said, making video content that is here's how to do the stretches that I've talked about doing. I think that a lot of people would gravitate more towards starting this as video content and then like, how do I translate that into a book? I don't agree with those people. I mean, I just, I perpetually have the opposing voice in my head at all times. So did you find it difficult to, to share the concepts that you wanted to share in written form?

Stephen: For myself... well, I think I found certain pieces of content easier to explain than others. I mean, clearly like explaining stretches through step by step processes is not as easy as it seems, because one sentence can mean one thing to one person and something completely different to another person. Like, what do you mean by put your heel, bring your heel to your butt? Like, what are you talking – Anyways. So like, wording can be very challenging when it comes to things like that. But other, otherwise there's a lot of thoughts that personally kind of just flowed onto the paper. And I think that's going to hold true for anyone that's writing. Right? It doesn't have to be something like me where I explain stretches or things, like it could be anyone that's writing. There's going to be certain things that are more challenging than others. I will say, when it comes to content creators, having a big so-called bank of content to pull from to make shorter bits of content, short form content, is really, really nice. Because then you don't have to really think through exactly what you're going to make for a certain day. You have your long form content, like a book. And then you can piece it up into different chapters, or different sections of different chapters, and turn that into Reels. Or Shorts or a blog post or a Thread or something on LinkedIn, you know what I mean?

Lauren: Yeah.

Stephen: So having something to pull from like that makes the whole content creation process so much more streamlined. I wouldn't say easier, but streamlined for sure. And clear.

Lauren: It's different. It's a different way of creating content. And it's also I mean, you mentioned this earlier, hopefully it was while we were recording and not before we started recording. But, you mentioned that people consume content differently, and that's why you have –

Stephen: Yeah.

Lauren: – these, these different channels and these different way of delivering content. And I 100% agree with that. And, you know, that is something that I push back on a lot when people say like, oh, I like the idea of writing a book, but I don't think my content lends itself to it. I would –

Stephen: Yeah.

Lauren: – usually challenge that.

Stephen: Yeah, yeah. I mean, to add to that, like. I met a cast member walking into Epcot the other day, and I was wearing a Powerline shirt. And she was like, oh I love your shirt. And then she proceeded to spend the next 30 seconds explaining how she, she’s collecting Disney VHS tapes of every single movie that's come out since they started. Which I think ends, I think she said it ends at Cars. But I looked at her and I was like, you can't be a day over like 25, you know? Like you, you, you’re collect– So my point being, people consume content very differently. Whether or not it’s to collect VHS tapes or to read a physical book versus listen to a podcast, watch something on Instagram, read a blog online. Right? So you want to, as a content creator, you want to put your content where people consume that content. Put that content where your audience lives, and they will find you. So like, again, the book is a great way to do that. And to trickle that down into other forms of content online, so that you can find your audience is a great strategy to go by.

Lauren: Well said. I, I also really need to meet that cast member now and ask her if she's interested in publishing a coffee table book of all the different VHS tapes she has.

Stephen: Oh, I wish I remembered her name. But she's at the tap point to enter into Epcot. So.

Lauren: Okay.

Stephen: I'm sure that chances are high to –

Lauren: I’ll just start walking around there like –

Stephen: – see her again. I know.

Lauren: – anyone, anyone here collecting VHS tapes?

Stephen: Do it. Do it. I would love to see that.

Lauren: It's like every ounce of introversion leaves my body the second that I step foot on Disney World property, and I actually probably would do that shamelessly.

Stephen: You know, thinking about it now like, Disney has been a great way to get out of my introverted self, for sure. I mean, there's still things that like, you know, recording stretch video content or like, talking head content in the parks still kind of terrifies me. But I still do it. But you know, I would not have, I would not have ever thought about doing that sort of thing if I didn't go to Disney so often. So yeah, Disney does that.

Lauren: Hey, I think wherever you find your, your comfort zone. Whether it's a physical comfort zone, a geographical location, or a mental comfort zone, power to you. And if that happens to be on Disney World property.... relatable. And a little jealous.

Stephen: Get to – yeah.

Lauren: Yep.

Stephen: Yeah.

[40:35] – Giving Advice to Other Creators

Lauren: Alright, well, I don't want to take up too much more of your time, but I do want to wrap this up nicely. So if there's anybody listening who has been like, okay, I've been thinking about publishing a book, maybe I wasn't sure if my content was right for it. Stephen has convinced me, let me reconsider this. Maybe see if, if there's something that I can make here. What advice would you give anyone that's in that, like, trying to decide phase?

Stephen: Yeah. So, first thing I would say is start small. Writing a – just even thinking about writing a book is very daunting to begin with. So start small. Start with something that you know. Start with a process or some sort of information that you know, love, and are passionate about. Something that sparks joy in you. Because you're going to be spending a lot of time writing and writing and rewriting and re-editing things. Or it could even be something that, like, sparks imagination. Right? Because then you can just kind of let your mind go wild on paper. Take that, start small, turn it into an outline, and you think it looks good... Send it to people that you trust. Because they will tell you what could be better, what could be different. Or if it's good to go. And then from there that'll be a good way to say, hey, maybe a book actually makes a lot of sense. If you can get to that point, I think, I think the rest of it actually is a lot easier than you think.

Lauren: How much does your writing routine look like your running training routine?

Stephen: It's a lot different nowadays. Around the time I was writing the book, I think I was writing every day, for maybe an hour at a time. Because like I, it was something I really, really like to do. Nowadays it's a lot different. So I've, I've literally taken all of my writing from blogs to social media posts to the book, and used AI to help recreate my voice. And then on top of that I do a, I do a lot of voice to text. S I will record myself talking, take those transcripts, and then use AI to help develop content that way. So that way it's not just AI slop, where it's like AI has created everything. It's my thoughts actually put into words. And then on top of that, I always, always, always check, recheck, rewrite. If, if things just don't sound like me, like I have a good – after writing for a while, I have a good sense of what my voice sounds like on paper. And I see myself editing and re-editing a lot of AI-developed stuff all the time. So that's where I am at the moment, only because I am spending a lot more time coaching, writing programing, trying to get more clients to, you know, work together. But like we mentioned earlier, I still have an idea in the back of my mind. And like I said, when I work with more people to train for their first runDisney race, writing towards that type of audience is going to be a lot more natural, and I guarantee you I will spend a lot more time just sitting down and typing away.

Lauren: I'm intrigued. And, and I do, I mean, I think that that's actually... Personally, I think that's exactly the right way to be using AI for something like this. You'll appreciate this. I was using voice to text to thought dump – just like stream of consciousness talk out an idea for a podcast episode – yesterday while I was doing my long run. So the first half hour of my long run yesterday, I was recording an extended voice note that when I got home from the run, I uploaded to ChatGPT and said can you, like, summarize this transcript in bullet points so that I don't have to listen to me like, huffing and puffing and heavy breathing for 30 minutes straight while I was trying to express these ideas to myself? And then, you know, I didn't use a single piece of content from that directly, but it was super helpful, and expedited the process, and is going to turn into an actual piece of content.

Stephen: If that lowers the barrier to someone to be able to write a book – Because that's still content that's still yours, right? But if that, again, if that lowers the barrier to be able to write out a book or write out an outline, then you are closer to being an author of a book than you have ever imagined. Like, we live in a crazy world where things are at our fingertips like this. And like... If you have something to share, an expertise, a thought, something you want to expand on, that you just want to get out there, like the book is a great way to do it. So don't let, don't let the thought of writing a large book just daunt you like that.

Lauren: I love it. I mean, I think I think that's it. Take it one day at a time. Know that you can do it. Just start with the outline. Which I also agree, I'm a huge outliner. That's, that's always my first, my first piece of advice.

Stephen: Clarity.

Lauren: So. Absolutely.

Stephen: So much clarity

Lauren: For sure. Start there and see where it goes.

[46:20] – Episode Wrap Up

Lauren: And I think that is the perfect note to end on.

Stephen: Sounds good to me.

Lauren: Thank you so much for joining us today. I think this was great. It was really fun to get to talk about the book and everything that led to it. I do have to ask one more question though, before... What is your favorite ride at Disney World?

Stephen: Oh gosh. Favorite ride at Disney World?

Lauren: Wow.

Stephen: You can’t – Oh man. I want to say Living with the Land, but that's getting a little too cliche at the, at the moment. I want to say Guardians, but that's a little bit too overused at the moment too. And I honestly, I prefer Guardians over at California Adventure. Oh man. I can't – why? I don't know why I can't answer this right now. This is, this is, you’ve, you’ve stumped me. I'm going to go out and say... I’m gonna go out and say Expedition Everest when they bring back the Yeti.

Lauren: Oh my God. The way that I woke up to that announcement and was like, this is the most important breaking news on my whole social media feed right now.

Stephen: Big deal. Very big deal.

Lauren: Absolutely incredible. I will, I will accept all three of those answers, because I think they're all legitimate. But I also completely agree it's, it's, I mean, that's like anytime anyone asks me like, what's your favorite book or what's your favorite concert you've ever been to or whatever, I'm like... that's like picking a favorite kid.

Stephen: Right. Exactly.

Lauren: I imagine. I don't have kids, but I assume that it's difficult, I don’t know. Well, I will let you, I will let you give all three of those in an answer, and we'll leave it at that.

Stephen: Thank you. Appreciate it.

Lauren: Alright. Stephen, thank you so much for joining us. For the listeners, I will obviously link in the show notes any, any resources, anything that will lead them to you. But if they're listening and can't check the show notes right now, where can they find you?

Stephen: Yeah, you can find everything, including my socials, my blog, my podcast, everything is at fitforthemagic.com. And if you are interested, like you are planning to go to Disney and you want to avoid, you know, your back hurting, the day four fatigue, so you don't, you feel like you don't get wrecked. You can start a chat with me fitforthemagic.com/disneyprep, and we can chat about where you want to go with this.

Lauren: Love it. And if you want to ask me any questions, not about Disney, but about – well, I mean, you can obviously ask me questions about Disney. Always. But if you want to ask any questions about turning your content into a book or anything else that goes along with it, you can always reach out on Lulu’s different social media channels, or you can email me at podcast@lulu.com. And thank you for listening, everyone. And Stephen, thanks again for joining us.

Stephen: Thanks for having me. This was great.

Lauren: It really was.