Lauren: Hey everyone, welcome back to another episode of Publish & Prosper. Today's going to be a fun one because I am sitting next to someone that isn't Matt.

Chelsea: Oh, you ruined my intro. 

Lauren: I'm so sorry. 

Chelsea: I was going to say I'm Matt. 

Lauren: You could imitate him as much as you want.

Chelsea: Well, I can't because you don't curse on this podcast. 

Lauren: That's true. Also, I imagine that would be a hard voice to maintain for the entire episode.

Chelsea: I wouldn't be able to talk for the rest of the week. 

Lauren: I think about that all the time. One of the actors from the show Supernatural talked about how he gave his character an unnaturally deep voice when he first started playing him. And then like ten years later when he was still on the show was like, I really regret that, that acting decision. So, yeah. 

Chelsea: Yeah, I'll maintain a pretty regular voice. I'll try. This is my normal speaking voice, so.

Lauren: Perfect. 

Chelsea: Not acting. 

Lauren: You're doing you're doing great. For those of you that are not watching this episode and you're wondering who that is. This is Chelsea Bennett. 

Chelsea: I am. 

Lauren: She will be joining me on the podcast today. 

Chelsea: Yes. Thank you so much for having me. I can't believe I got the invite to the podcast. I feel like I'm really moving up in life. 

Lauren: It’s a - it's a pretty exclusive invite, honestly. 

Chelsea: It is. Only two people can be in this room at a time. 

Lauren: Yeah. 

Chelsea: They had to kick Matt out for me to be in here. 

Lauren: We did. Well, we tried to record it with three people one time and it was a struggle, so.

Chelsea: I saw. I saw. Sarah Gilbert just looked like she was your overlord sitting really high above you.

Lauren: I know. 

Chelsea: So yeah, this is a good setup, I think. 

Lauren: Yeah. So we thought we would try something new today – 

Chelsea: Let’s do it. 

Laurene: – and do it with the two of us. If you are watching on YouTube or if you're listening to this and you're going, Hmm, that voice sounds familiar. You've probably seen and heard Chelsea before. She is our primary YouTube personality. 

Chelsea: Yes. Like and subscribe, if you're not already. 

Lauren: Yeah, please do. And also has hosted many of our webinars. 

Chelsea: Yes. 

Lauren: And many of our virtual events. 

Chelsea: Yes. 

Lauren: And appearances and stuff like that.

Chelsea: Yes. 

Lauren: So do you want to tell us a little bit more about like, what you do here? 

Chelsea: Yeah. Yeah, I've been at Lulu. Actually, I was saying this the other day that I just celebrated my eighth year anniversary at Lulu. Very exciting. 

Lauren: Congratulations.

Chelsea: Yes. So I have been fortunate to be able to get out in front of people and do speaking engagements, webinars, go to conferences, virtual events, and our YouTube channel, which has been very exciting. So if you are in need of any information or content about publishing, that's usually what we talk about. That's actually all I talk about. I don't have a co-host on the Lulu U videos, so I don't get unhinged, unfortunately. I feel like you guys have a lot more fun, but yeah, check it out.

Lauren: Actually, that's a great first question for me. What do you think the difference is on that? You know, I’ve thought about that before, where it's just you on your own recording those versus me and Matt in here together. Like, do you think that one is easier than the other or do you think there are pros and cons to both? 

Chelsea: There have to be pros and cons to both, I think. It's probably easier - well, I mean, it just depends on your personality. I think for me, I think it's easier to just be by myself. But then you don't have someone being like, hey, what are you talking about? Like, there's no one… Well, I will say, to lift the veil a little bit. My husband is a videographer, so he films our Lulu U videos. And then we have Ashley, who's amazing, who's on the Lulu team, who edits them. But, you know, he will humble me every now and again and be like, what are you doing? You're going off on a tangent. What you said doesn't make sense. So that's good.

Lauren: Wow. 

Chelsea: But I think it's nice to have, you know, a co-host and some banter every now and again. So you can go either or. 

Lauren: Yeah, I think that's fair. 

Chelse: Yeah. 

Lauren: So I guess that's right off the bat. Anyone listening to this who is thinking about doing any kind of video content or using video as a marketing tool or a brand growth tool. If you're debating having a co-host with you or doing it by yourself, pros and cons to both. 

Chelsea: Yeah. 

Lauren: Personally, if somebody's sitting in the co-host seat, I would recommend doing it alone. Just kidding, Matt. Miss you, wish you were here. 

Chelse: Miss you, Matt. You're the best. 

Lauren: He's going to listen to this and be like, you're both fired. Get out of here. 

Chelsea: Oh, gosh. We make this really worth it then. 

Lauren: It's going to be worth it. If it's going to be the last episode, it's going to be the best episode. 

Chelsea: Click the link in the description below for my GoFundMe. 

Lauren: Yeah, help us. It's going to be great. 

[4:41]

Lauren: But yeah, so we thought we would talk to you all today about video content and kind of a lot of the different things that go with it. Also just kind of going to put a disclaimer up at the top that when we're talking about video content in this particular episode, I don't think we're really talking about things like TikToks or Instagram Reels or –

Chelsea: Right.

Lauren: – that like, short form social media video content. 

Chelsea: Yeah, I don't do a lot of that. I mean, sometimes the content that we make for our YouTube channel gets chopped up for things like that. And we do Shorts, which has been interesting to play around with. But for – I mean, my experience is really more in the longer form content. 

Lauren: Yeah. 

Chelsea: Creating that for Lulu, yeah. 

Lauren: Yeah, so that's definitely what we're going to focus more on today. That idea of – and you've done, I was actually, I was thinking about this yesterday while I was writing out my list of questions. The amount of different types of long form video content that you've created for Lulu – 

Chelsea: Yeah. 

Lauren: – is substantial. 

Chelsea: Eight years worth. 

Lauren: Eight years worth. But also just like. kind of running the gamut of YouTube videos. If you haven't watched any of our Lulu U videos, highly recommend. 

Chelsea: Highly recommend.

Lauren: Plug yourself, go ahead. 

Chelsea: Could not recommend more highly for you to watch these videos, yeah. 

Lauren: They are great.

Chelsea: Thank you. 

Lauren: But they are like… I love them. They make me laugh out loud all the time and they're educational. So that's fun. 

Chelsea: Edutainment. I try to be in that lane –

Lauren: I think you nail it. 

Chelsea: – as much as possible. 

Lauren: I think you nail it. But there's also then you do also a lot of our tutorial videos, which is a different, definitely a different kind of video style and approach than the Lulu Us. 

Chelsea: Yeah. 

Lauren: You've also done webinars. 

Chelsea: I have. 

Lauren: And you've done virtual events which are like live events and stuff like that. And the online course that we did.

Chelsea: I did do that. I've also interviewed Bob Young twice. 

Lauren: Wow. 

Chelsea: I know. I know. So I mean, I know that - I don't know how much time you have to go through all my accolades but – I mean I can keep going. 

Lauren: As much time as you want. 

Chelsea: Yeah we've done, we've done a lot of content and you know, for anyone that is thinking about trying to introduce video content into their repertoire or as a lead gen or brand building tool, you know, there's a lot that you can play around with. There's so many formats and it really depends on your content and then, you know, what your audience is coming to you for. 

So I mean, as you said, tutorials, those are great. And maybe playing around with the length of videos, webinars, obviously longer, this podcast, of course, is longer. And then sometimes depending, you know, on the content, if it's just how to publish a book, you want to get in and out with that. 

Lauren: Yeah. 

Chelsea: So you try to make those a little bit quicker, but there's so much that you can play around with. I mean, the tone, the delivery, the graphics, if you wanna have those. I mean, for a long time, our videos were just me staring into a camera with a gray screen behind me and just talking about bookish things. And recently – more recently, I've been like, this is not, as much as I love myself, have, know, my self esteem is pretty solid, but I'm like, we gotta cut this out. There has to be something more visually engaging than me talking. So yeah, there's just a lot of room to play around with it and a lot of room for creativity if you want to explore it. 

Lauren: How did you actually make that decision? Because I did notice recently that we've kind of shifted what the Lulu U videos look like –

Chelsea: Yes. 

Lauren: – right now. And there's a lot, mean, pretty dramatically from what they used to be. And part of that has been an evolution over time. 

Chelsea: Yes. 

Lauren: But definitely, like if you looked at a video from seven years ago and then you looked at the most recent one, there are very- 

Chelsea: You’ll notice I've only gotten older. Yeah. 

Lauren: You haven't aged a day, I don't know what you're talking about. 

Chelsea: Bless you, bless you. 

Lauren: But how do you decide that? Did you research better practices for YouTube or was it something you were experimenting with? What kind of led to that decision to change it up a little bit? 

Chelsea: Well, as you said, or maybe I said this, but I've been doing this for a long time, you know? I've been making these videos for a long time. I thought it was kind of getting boring. Our editor, Ashley, who is so amazing and so talented – I think she maybe has the hardest job at Lulu because she has watched so many hours of me fumbling through scripts and trying to figure out the right words to say and then, you know, cursing if I can't get it right. 

So, you know, I just wanted it to be more interesting. And also, you know, I thought it may be more interesting for her as well to just try a different format and try something else. And then, you know, to your point about best practices, when you look at… I looked at creators on YouTube who were making educational content or, you know, as I said, like edutainment and they are doing a lot of B-roll, a lot of cutaways. You know, we tried…we experimented with like, inserting memes and gifts. Sometimes that lands, sometimes it doesn't. 

So it just kind of, you know, as you evolve and you grow and you're making content, you want to continue giving your audience what they're looking for. But also trying to reach a wider audience and just continue evolving how polished the content is, how professional it looks. So it's really just trying to, to continue doing better than we have in the past. So that was kind of what was behind that. And also I'm just like, how many more years can I stare into a camera and talk with people wanting to watch this? We've got to, you know, hopefully make it a bit more engaging and interesting for the audience. So that's where it came from. 

Lauren: Well, I think so far it's working. 

Chelsea: Well thank you. 

Lauren: You're welcome. I definitely laughed out loud again at a few of the most recent videos. 

Chelsea: Excellent, yes. 

Lauren: So. Maybe we should back up a little bit though. Let's define, I guess, the point of all of this. 

Chelsea: Yeah. Of video content?

Lauren: Of video content, of like… 

Chelsea: Yeah. 

Lauren: You know, we're kind of making the argument, I think, that video content, long-form video content like we're talking about, is something that can be a value add… 

Chelsea: Yes 

Lauren: To authors or content entrepreneurs. Obviously we're not talking to people who are already video content creators and –

Chelsea: Make more video content. 

Lauren: Like. Right. 

Chelsea: Double down.

Lauren: Y'all know what you're doing already. But to people that are looking for ways to grow their brand and grow their readership and grow their audience and are considering maybe adding a video element to it. Like, I think that's who we're talking to?  

Chelsea: I think so. 

Lauren: Here? Yeah. 

Chelsea: Drop a comment if that's you. 

Lauren: Please do. 

[10:28]

Lauren: What do you think is the value add of adding some kind of video element to your marketing strategy? 

Chelsea: Well, I think for most…and again, it is really dependent on the content. Like if you're making, if your content is very technical, then I would say video is a tool to help your audience get through your content or your framework or your process easier, and they just have visual cues for how to do it. But if you are an author or a content creator who isn't doing something super technical, I think it really just humanizes your brand. It allows people to connect with you on a more authentic level. And so I think that that's really the value add, is more and more with the world that we live in with AI and automation and all of these things, I think people are really hungry for authenticity. And so being able to come on video, and it doesn't have to be super highly polished or produced, but being able to put up a video and just tell people about your process or why you're doing things or kind of share your why. 

We've done a lot of research at Lulu to understand that people really connect with these things. And so I think it really just gives you more of a connection to your audience and lets them understand who the person is behind the brand and your motivations for doing it. And helps them align with you a bit more. And then connect with you. There's also the engagement piece of it where you can have a conversation with your audience. And so I think that those are the most powerful ways that you can use video to really kind of grow your brand and enhance your presence online, I would say. 

Lauren: Yeah, I think that's fair. I mean, we see it all the time. I can't tell you the number of times that I've been at an event and somebody has come up to the booth, at least once every event that I've been at, that somebody has come up and been like is Chelsea here? Or like, where's the girl who's on your YouTube channel like, is she here? You have absolutely become…I don't want to say a brand ambassador but kind of, like –

Chelsea: I would be proud to ambass for Lulu.

Lauren: Perfect. I can't wait to use that sound bite for this episode. Thank you so much. 

Chelsea: Yeah, I - you know, I mean it’s – video is, you can do a faceless channel. We were kind of talking about that. Because there is a level of, you know, just putting yourself out there with anything. And I mean, that's, it's the same for like, you know, if you put it, I was going to say a tweet or an X. I heard someone call it an excrement, like that's, instead of calling it a tweet. So if you put out an excrement. 

Lauren: Perfect. 

Chelsea: But anything you put out online, there is that level of like putting yourself out there in front of the world, essentially. And so video content, if you are someone who it is, you can't get out of bed with the thought that you're going to do that, then maybe it's not for you. Or maybe you do a faceless channel. There are so many channels that are really popular that you never see the creators' faces. 

Lauren: Yup. 

Chelsea: Maybe you just hear their voice. But you know creating video content there is that level of you're putting yourself out there and kind of seeing if it works and I think more and more people are… You know, it's not weird anymore to say I have a YouTube channel, or I'm doing this. And I think if you are thinking about trying video content, and it doesn't have to be on YouTube, but just kind of letting yourself…giving yourself permission to say I'm gonna try this and if it works great and if it doesn't then I'll move on. And not thinking the metrics that you see from a video are in any way tied to your self-worth. It's an important thing to differentiate that if you are going to make video content, I will say. 

Lauren: Yeah, I think that's very reasonable. And like more so, I think, with video content like that –

Chelsea: Yeah. 

Lauren: – than with some of the other kinds of social media content that we see. Because there is definitely – 

Chelsea: Right. 

Lauren: – something a little bit personal and vulnerable about putting your face – 

Chelsea: Yes. 

Lauren: Out there. 

Chelsea: Oh, yeah. 

Lauren: For sure. 

Chelsea: Yeah. 

[14:12]

Lauren: What would you say, like, do you have any advice for people that are okay with that idea in theory, but they're just a little bit nervous about getting on camera? Were you ever nervous about getting on camera, or were you right away like, no, I got this, it's fine? 

Chelsea: Yeah, I mean, I will say for whatever reason it doesn't…yeah, I was kind of fine with it, but it's because I'm just looking into a camera and just talking and there's no, the audience isn't immediately there. So it was very easy for me to do. But I also understand that it is really intimidating to stare into a camera, especially if you get wrapped up in the fact that well, I'm gonna go live and then anyone can see this and share their thoughts about what you're doing. I guess my advice would be, give yourself permission to do it. And I think for me, it's helpful to say, this is just an experiment. I'm just trying it. It's okay to try something else. And then give yourself grace. Like, don't be your biggest critic. You will have people online who will do that for you. You don't need to hop on the bandwagon. 

But just know it's okay to try things and know that you're going to mess up and there are going to be people – It doesn't matter if you do everything right. If you nail every line, if you go first, try no warmup, don't have to do any retakes. Someone is going to come in your comments at some point and be like, that's a dumb shirt or like, whatever. And you know, but you can't worry about those things. And I still, that's something that I struggle with because people, you know, if I go on and look at our YouTube comments and someone that says something disparaging about me, it does kind of take you out of it. You're like, gosh, you know? And you have these thoughts of like, what does this mean? And am I not doing great and I suck and all that. So yeah, you can't do that. 

I mean, it's much easier said than done, but you have to kind of be able to step away from it and realize like, this is content I'm putting out there, but it doesn't, you know, it doesn't make me, it doesn't affect my value if people don't like it. You know what I mean? And also if you are genuinely trying to serve your audience and really trying to offer valuable content, the people that need to find it are going to find it and they're going to appreciate it. So. If you are intimidated by it, then really just think, is this going to be valuable for you or is it going to cause you anxiety and make you have ulcers because you can't even fathom putting yourself out there like that? 

But I would just say you can try it. The Internet does live forever, but it also moves really quickly, so you can delete it and move on. 

Lauren: That's so true. And I have definitely… I've seen a lot of the comments on our YouTube channel –

Chelsea: Yeah. 

Lauren: – and so many times had the thought of like God, Chelsea's got thick skin to be able to do this.

Chelsea: Yeah, yeah. 

Lauren: Like, that takes a lot of mettle to be able to ignore this. So kudos to you for that. 

Chelsea: Yeah, well – 

Lauren: Because – 

Chelsea: That is one thing that I was going to say is if you do want to do it, just go ahead and have a mental process in place to be able to take in this and then move away from it. Like I think that I've worked on that and just being able to realize that like every, you know, these keyboard warriors that want to hop on, they're not doing the thing you're doing the thing. 

Lauren: Yeah.

Chelsea: So at the end of the day, even if you tried to do a run of videos, you thought this is not for me and moved on and you got hate comments, whatever, that person's not doing it. You're actually doing the work and you've learned from that and you're growing from it. And you know, I think you'll get more comfortable. And I also think, as I said, you are your biggest critic and it's so easy – when I watched some of my older videos, I mean, there's some where I thought my hair looked bad. I was sweating. I look, you know, whatever. I mean, you know, thin, fat, tan, not tan, you know, stupid, whatever. So, you're your biggest critic and just know that people don't care. They're not worried about that. They're there for the information. And again, if you can serve your audience and add value, then that's going to rise to the top and you're going to connect with the people you need to, I think. 

Lauren: That's such a valuable thing to keep in mind in so many different circumstances. I mean, I was telling somebody recently that for this podcast, I have made an active, intentional effort to not wear the same shirt twice. 

Chelsea: Oh, my gosh. 

Lauren: In videos.

Chelsea: I gave up on that so many years ago. 

Lauren: And that's what like the person that I said that to was like, why? Do you think anybody other than you is going to notice? And I was like, well, that's a really good point actually. 

Chelsea: I know I do the same thing. And like I was thinking about that because I film, you know, Lulu U on Friday and I'm like going through my closet and I'm like, well, what have I worn before? What haven't I worn? And I'm like, hey, no, I mean, listen, I know that people love, you know, I hope, love the channel and they're watching them, but I don't have any stans or going to like, why are you wearing that plaid shirt twice? 

Lauren: Like. 

Chelsea: Change clothes. You know what I mean? 

Lauren: Can you believe she repeated – 

Chelsea: I know, I know. 

Lauren: – the shirt she wore three years ago in another video? 

Chelsea: I know, I know, I know. I was pretty bummed that you guys don't have hair and makeup and wardrobe. I came thinking that was going to work out. You guys, got to talk next time I interview Bob, that'll be one of the questions. What is the wardrobe and makeup budget? 

Lauren: But yeah, I mean, I do think that's really just something that is really valuable to remember for people when considering the idea of creating video content. Or creating any kind of, I mean, any content that you're putting out there, even publishing books.

Chelsea: Oh my gosh, yes.

Lauren: It's impossible to publish a book or to write a book without putting a little piece of yourself into it. 

Chelsea: Oh yeah, oh yeah. 

Lauren: Fiction or nonfiction, for sure. Which actually, I guess that's usually something that we try to do on this podcast is – 

Chelsea: Talk about books? 

Lauren: Occasionally. Very rarely, but occasionally. Is try to make it clear whether or not we're talking to nonfiction authors, fiction authors, or we think that something is applicable to both. 

Chelsea: Yeah. 

[19:12]

Lauren: Do you think that there's value… I mean, we've talked about your experience creating edutainment content, which obviously kind of naturally lends itself to a nonfiction…

Chelsea: Yes. 

Lauren: …author, but do you think that there is value for fiction authors in creating video content as well?

Chelsea: Yeah, I think so. I mean, I think it goes back to that just really being more personable and humanizing yourself to your audience. You know, we talk about this a lot at Lulu, but fiction, the fandom around fiction is so ravenous. And so, you know, people want to know who the author is. They want to know more about you. And so I think also for fiction, it lends itself to video, but also maybe more casual videos. So it's like, you know, for some videos, it makes sense to get lighting and get the camera and get the setup and really go the extra mile to make sure it looks really professional and polished. Because you are trying to present yourself as an authority. To your point about why we edited them differently for the last round, I was like, I need a desk. You know, it's like,

Lauren: Yeah. 

Chelsea: I can't just sit here on a chair anymore. Like, you know, I have to have a desk. That's what all these people, oh I just happened to be working on something really noble and now there's a camera in my face and I'll talk to you. I was like, that's, I felt, maybe a good evolution for our channel. 

But for fiction content, could be much more approachable, like getting your phone out and just saying, hey, I'm writing my pages today and here's what I'm doing. Or here's where I like to write, or getting ready for this event. Or, you know, I'm about to go live with my community. And also just the channel to ask questions and get feedback. And, you know, for better or worse, the time that we live in, it's so easy to get in that feedback loop and really hear from your audience. And I think that can be really valuable for fiction and nonfiction. 

But if you're a fiction author and you're churning out books like we see that some are, then you can instantaneously put up a video and say, hey, I'm working on this. What do you think? Here are my covers. Here's what this character is doing. Here's what I'm thinking. And really get that buy in and kind of build that fandom around your brand. 

Lauren: Yeah, totally. 

Chelsea: So I think there's a place for it. Do you concur? 

Lauren: I absolutely do. Yeah. That was fully a leading question to be like, yes, I do think this is relevant.

Chelsea: I love fiction. 

Lauren: Yeah. I mean, we're often in here a lot of the times we fall into this spectrum of I am much more interested in fiction and my conversation tends to lean more towards fiction authors and Matt tends to be the nonfiction author advocates. 

Chelsea: Yes. 

Lauren: So I'm always in here being like, hey, this is relevant to fiction authors. 

Chelsea: Yeah, I do think but it's also so based on personality, too, because, you know, to be a writer, it can be so individual and very isolating at times. So, and a lot of people, you know, that's why we have so many questions about the marketing piece of it. And so for some people, when you think of marketing as a challenge, then putting yourself out there and making a video is just like almost too much. 

So I think it really just depends on personality as well. But absolutely, you know, I think fiction authors can do really, really well with video and we've seen that. And then, you know, nonfiction, of course, as well, because you can, you know, really expand on your content and what you're trying to teach your audience. 

Lauren: Yeah, absolutely.

[22:18]

Lauren: I want to go back to something that you said in there, because we've kind of been focusing more on scripted, edited, pre-recorded video content. But you also have a lot of experience with live video. So whether that looks like a webinar or some kind of event or…I mean, we've seen all kinds of different virtual book – 

Chelsea: Yeah. 

Lauren: – and publishing events. And even like you said, going live in a community. How do you see that differently? Like, do you approach that differently? And do you think it has different value? I can – we can do this one at a time. How do you approach that differently? Do you approach that differently? Live video versus recorded video? 

Chelsea: Yeah, well for live videos, you know, usually I'm kind of working through a slide deck and kind of going through it. But for live videos, I mean, to be very honest, whenever I do a live session, whether it's a webinar or a presentation, I always just try to set an intention before I do it of being helpful and of really trying to add value to the audience. I think it really goes back to that. Because I was reading something that's like, it's only…basically 80% like your tone and the way you deliver things, but 20% people actually listening to what you're saying. So you can, you know, fumble words around, but really again, if you're delivering it, I think authentically and your…you care and you're really trying to get it across, then I think the audience gives you a lot of grace, especially in a live situation. 

So, but I always try to approach, you know, anytime I'm presenting or trying to teach anything is like, you know, how can I help and can I offer this in a way that is going to be valuable and approachable? And I think that that is important if you can do that. And sometimes, you know, if you're frantic about it, then that's not super helpful. But I do try to do that. But whenever I'm doing live presentations that I have an outline, I have a slide deck that I'm going through.

I also try to start by just kind of getting a little icebreaker, you know? Just asking people where they're from or have you published before or whatever your content is. One really fun one that I did for a romance conference was like the street you grew up on plus the last thing you ate is your erotica author name. 

Lauren: Love that. 

Chelsea: And then people – yeah, what would yours, what would yours be? Let's see. The thing that you ate last and then the street that you grew up on.

Lauren: What did I eat last? 

Chelsea: Don't try to church it up now for the pod. 

Lauren: No, no, no. I'm trying. I'm genuinely trying to remember. 

Chelsea: Bag of Doritos

Lauren: It was toast. 

Chelsea: Toast? 

Lauren: Toast Peachtree. 

Chelsea: Toast Peachtree? That's pretty good. 

Lauren: That is pretty good.

Chelsea: Toast Peachtree, yeah. 

Lauren: Toast is a very appropriate name. That's pretty much all I eat is bread.

Chelsea: I like that. So yeah, so just doing something fun like that or like I like to see if there's like a fun fact for the day or like a national holiday that's silly or whatever. So just trying to, you know, invite some conversation. And then, you know, getting into it and then leaving as much time for questions at the end because the value of a live session is that you're there to answer questions. And with publishing, my favorite term is you don't know what you don't know. Because whenever I started working at Lulu, I'm like, oh, self-publishing, you do it all by yourself, how great, this is so approachable. 

But now that I've been here for a while, I realize it's not a like, individual sport. If you wanna do it well, it should be done with a team of people. And that team can be one other person, it could be, you know, whatever your budget allows. But so when you are doing a live session, just kind of keep that in mind that really people are gonna wanna be able to talk to you about their specific situations. And so being able to offer that I think is the biggest value of doing a live video.

Lauren: That’s something that we talk about a lot on air and off the air is that value of having that open line of communication with your customers.

Chelsea: Yeah. 

Lauren: And with your readers and with your audience and how that really… I mean, we've talked about that in terms of this is how you turn casual fans into true loyal fans. 

Chelsea: Yes.

Lauren: This is how you connect with new audiences because, you know, they remember you. I mean, I - I remember the people that I felt a connection with. 

Chelsea: Right. 

Lauren: When they were like, speakers at sessions that were relatable and authentic and engaging.

Chelsea: Oh yeah.

Lauren: And then like, took questions or I spoke to them afterwards. Those are the ones that stick in my memory… 

Chelsea: Yeah. 

Lauren: Way more than the ones that just lectured at me –

Chelsea: Yeah. Right. 

Lauren: – for forty-five minutes. Right? 

Chelsea: Right. Just bloviating and you're just like, listening to the sound of your own voice, which can happen. I mean, you know, hey. Bless them, whatever works. 

Lauren: I mean, I host a podcast. 

Chelsea: Not you. Certainly not you. 

Lauren: I love the sound of my own voice. If you're listening to this podcast and you haven't picked up on that fact yet, I don't know what to tell you.

Chelsea: Drop a like if you love Lauren's voice.

Lauren: Perfect. Great. Like and subscribe. 

Chelsea: Like and subscribe. Love it. Yeah. Yeah. 

Lauren: But this is just another form of something that we talk about all the time. Where it  – 

Chelsea: Yeah. 

Lauren: This is another way for you to forge authentic connections with your audience. And also hopefully to get yourself in front of a new audience. 

Chelsea: Yeah. 

Lauren: We've talked about the value of public speaking. One of the references or one of the episodes, oh my God, words. One of the things that I have referenced possibly more than any other piece of content that we've created, on this podcast, is the webinar that you did with Stephanie Chandler like – 

Chelsea: Ugh, love Stephanie.

Lauren: – two or three years ago. 

Chelsea: Shout out Stephanie Chandler, NFAA founder. If you are a nonfiction author, go check them out. It's a wonderful community. 

Lauren: Yeah, definitely do. Highly recommend. But I plug the webinar that she did with you a couple of years ago –  

Chelsea: She’s great.

Lauren: – on public speaking.

Chelsea. Oh, yeah. 

Lauren: She talked about how to use your book as like, a entryway into public speaking and or user public speaking as an entryway into like selling your book. 

Chelsea: Yeah. 

Lauren: I think I reference that at least once every month on this podcast. 

Chelsea: Oh, it's great.

Lauren: Like, it is such a phenomenal webinar. But even just that, even talking about that right now and talking about how often I reference that, like that is a prime example of  somebody creating an opportunity for themselves. That was a Lulu hosted webinar that wasn't – 

Chelsea: Yup. 

Lauren: I mean, Stephanie also has her own community – 

Chelsea: Right.

Lauren: – where she hosts her own content. But that was something that she was a guest on one of our webinars. And even years later now that is still theoretically adding value –

Chelsea: Oh yeah. 

Lauren: – to her brand because even if one person every time that I reference it clicks on that link to go check it out. 

Chelsea: Right.

Lauren: That's one new person in her audience that wasn't there before. 

Chelsea: Well, right. And much like, you know, we say about books and like growing your audience while you sleep. The content that we're making will, this will go on even, you know, we're making money for Lulu as we sleep, hopefully. You know what I mean? 

Lauren: Wow. 

Chelsea: I know. Yeah. But, you know, it's true that when you put this content out there, then it can live forever. And then, you know, when we say like and subscribe, like and subscribe. But. These metrics that you look at, even if you don't see…and I mean, the metrics that you think are important can change, but you have to remember the shelf life of videos, if it's good, can be up forever. And I mean, some of our best performing videos are some of the first ones that we did just about formatting. I mean, that's such a struggle for people, especially again, if you are trying to go more of a DIY route. But just the basics. Metadata. You did a great short for us about five indicators your book is self-published. 

So these things that you do that can kind of live forever and then are great reference points and then you don't have to keep regurgitating the same thing or keep telling someone how to use your book as a way to get into speaking or how to speak to get book sales or whatever. You can just point them to this podcast or this long form video that you've done and hopefully they'll be able to engage with it, watch it at their own pace and self study and be able to get what they need from it that way.

Lauren: I have watched, I personally have watched that fun with formatting webinar at least ten times.

Chelsea: I know formatting is so hard. 

Lauren: Every time that I have tried to create a book on Lulu, I've watched it and I literally, I will sit there and I will play the part that I need and then pause it and do whatever was done in the video. 

Chelsea: Oh so it’s you. It's you that's boosting the views. Yeah.

Lauren: It's me. But absolutely that is, and that content is, I think we filmed that like…

Chelsea: That was maybe 2018, I feel like. 2019. It was forever ago.

Lauren: I was here for it. 

Chelsea: Yeah. 

Lauren: So it was, I think, 2019.

Chelsea: Yeah. 

Lauren: But it was within the first six months that I started here. 

Chelsea: Oh yeah. 

Lauren: So that video is at least six years old. 

Chelsea: Yeah. You know, I need to watch that video because the first book that I tried to publish at Lulu, it ended up with no page numbers because I couldn't even figure out how to do that. So yeah, shout out. If you need help with formatting, that webinar is a great one. I mean, these things that you… You know, I know that we make good content and we definitely try really hard to make it high quality. But you know, sometimes you just don't know what's going to resonate and what's going to stick with your audience. 

I would also say for anyone who's trying or interested in trying videos, you can't be precious about it. You have to, I mean, we were talking about having a thick skin. But there are some things that I just thought were so funny And also, you know, the new videos that we're doing or the videos that we're doing now, I'm not like trying to play around with a cute intro anymore. I’m like, hey, welcome to the channel. Let's get into it. You know, cause the retention rates. 

Lauren: That’s true. 

Chelsea: You know, it's hard to people's advice – or not advice. Well. If you have advice, drop in the comments. But it's hard to get their attention and keep it. So yeah, being able to really get into something and dive in and then looking at what people are watching and what they're resonating and then being able to do more of that. And being able to kind of you know, not get your ego too involved and say, you know, just because they didn't think it was hilarious doesn't mean that I'm a bad person. It could just keep going, you know? 

Lauren: Also doesn't mean it wasn't funny. 

Chelsea: Right? Yeah. It doesn't mean I'm not hilarious either, but yeah. Um, so being able to kind of cater to the audience, once you start to see things take off and not being afraid to do more of what they like and, you know, maybe go against some of your, your initial instincts there. 

[31:48]

Lauren: What do you look at? Not to get too in the weeds about this, but what metrics or what kind of like hallmarks are you looking for when you're looking back at a video performance to kind of see like, okay, I was trying something new in this episode or in this video, let's see if it worked. Let's see if it didn't. Like what are the indicators that you're looking for to tell you whether or not you should continue doing something that you did in a recent video, or shift?

Chelsea: My paycheck. No, no.

Lauren: Perfect answer. 

Chelsea: Yeah, well, it's changed. It's changed because at the beginning I was just like subscribers. We've to get the subscribers. That's the most important thing. And I was a novice to YouTube as well. So that's the most visible metric. And then the likes and comments and all of that. But for Lulu–and again, this can change depending on your content and how you're using video. 

But what I realized over the past couple of years is the subscribers, even though we want that, what's more important for us is click-through rates. Are people going to the description and clicking over to Lulu? Are they getting to Lulu to take action on the information that we're giving them? So watch time and then the click-through rates are really the biggest things that we're looking at now. So that's what I am trying to improve on. And, you know, you can obviously, YouTube has fantastic analytics.

Lauren: Oh, incredible. 

Chelsea: We’ve talked about this before. And you can see so much. So even if you were approaching this as a novice like I was, it's so easy for you to get a pretty good snapshot of what people are liking and what they aren't, what they're interacting with, obviously. But for me now, I mean, I would love to get more comments and have more of a conversation. I think you guys do such a good job with the podcast because it's so approachable and it's just, you know, two buds talking about pod. It's like the podcast should be called POD Pod. I meant to say that. Print-on-Demand podcast. POD Pod. 

Lauren: Where were you a year and half ago? 

Chelsea: I know, I know. I mean, this is fine, but you know, whatever. But this could be POD Pod. So yeah, but for me now, really what I'm trying to do is make our content, the CTAs and measuring that. So am I doing a good job at describing the accessibility and the ease of use or describing the value of having a book and why you should do it? And is that compelling enough that someone's going to go in the description and click, okay, let me create my account today, or let me get over to the Lulu site. 

So that is much more valuable to me now at the end of the day. And previously I would have been like, well, our subscriber count is really the holy grail, but it's not. For me and our business goals, that's not the leading indicator. So that's what I'm looking at is like…are we keeping retention? Are people coming back? Is it new people that are watching the video? Is it people who have been in our audience for a while? Shout out to both. 

Lauren: Yeah, Shout out to our regular podcast –

Chelsea: Yeah. 

Lauren: – episode commenters. 

Chelsea: That's right, yes.  

Lauren: I see you all. 

Chelsea: I know. 

Lauren: I know who you are. I appreciate every single one of your comments. 

Chelsea: Yeah, I was actually having this conversation the other day, but it's like, I don't know if people know when they comment that it's us looking at them. 

Lauren: Yeah. 

Chelsea: And responding. So it's like a shout out, you know, so it is. You know, it's not anyone else. It's, you know, we're very involved in this day to day. So the comments are also great because you can see…I love being able to see the comments and the questions that we get, and being able to understand where we are doing a good job explaining things and where people do need more help or more assistance. 

And that also helps us identify gaps to where we can create more content. But yeah, the short answer to that would be in the beginning subscribers, you know, I kind of fell into that. What I think all people who are on YouTube do. And now it's really evolved to like the subscribers are great, but really I want to see actions taken on the content that I'm sharing. 

[35:28]

Lauren: Which I think makes a lot of sense and I think is probably the most applicable answer to our listeners that would have any interest in this because this is still another example of like we've talked about so many other times in so many different areas, YouTube is still rented land.

Chelsea: Oh yeah. 

Lauren: In the same way that, that social media or any other kind of like, engagement platform is, it's still rented land. So your long term goal should still be to get your subscribers, your followers, your readers onto something that you control primarily an email list. 

Chelsea: Yes. 

Lauren: So this is absolutely… if you're using YouTube or long form video content or anything like that as a way to establish yourself as a voice of expertise or authority. You're using it as a way to expand upon the ideas in your book. Let's say you're a cookbook…author. 

Chelsea: Yeah, you could be a –

Lauren: Chef?

Chelsea: Sure you could, you could have said anything that you want to do there.

Lauren: You're a chef that has published a cookbook and then you want to create video content that is you demonstrating how to create the recipes. 

Chelsea: I love that idea. 

Lauren: Great idea. Love that. 

Chelsea: As an aside.

Lauren: But like you're still–yeah, you guys can have that one for free. No one's ever thought of that idea before. 

Chelsea: You heard it here first on POD Pod. 

Lauren: Brand new, all yours. You can take it. Just, you know, shout me out in the acknowledgement on the book. 

Chelsea: Right, right. 

Lauren: But you're ultimately, like you're still hoping that whatever whatever reason you are or it's you're creating it for fun to like have a better…

Chelsea: Yeah.

Lauren: Community and opportunity to speak to your audience. You still want to eventually drive those people to your own website, to your own mailing list, to whatever. 

Chelsea: Right.

Lauren: So I think that you're absolutely right. 

Chelsea: Yeah.

Lauren: That you're looking at what actions are taking from the video is really important.

Chelsea: Yeah. And I mean, again, it can evolve over time and maybe your video content, you know, vehicle is completely altruistic. And that's wonderful. But yeah, I mean, usually at the end of the day, at the very least, you want eyes on it. And so, yeah, but that's a great point. I…Sometimes when I'm doing a presentation, I have this graphic that Alex made for me that's like rented land to owned land to transaction. It's a little funnel, if you can–if the listener or viewer can fathom that, that's what it looks like.

But yeah, it's this idea that when you get an audience on YouTube, how can you get them over to your website, your email list? Then that's where you want to have the transaction occur. Because yeah, YouTube is great. But there are things there that happen that you don't have control over. One of the things that we were working on this year was trying to not have ads play that don't align with our content. 

Lauren: Right. 

Chelsea: Or that don't really serve our audience. So that's something that you have a little bit of control over, but again, there's still a lot of opportunities for a viewer to drop off or go somewhere else. And so making sure that you are using that time to have that strong CTA or at least just have a plan in place where to connect outside of the platform is always a good idea.

Lauren: It's always a good idea. We cannot emphasize this enough. 

Chelsea: Yeah.

Lauren: Like, making sure that you have a backup strategy for connecting with your audience on more than one platform. 

Chelsea: Yeah. And I mean, it takes time and it does take effort to do that and to figure out that transition and make it smooth and then compel people to do that. I also think, you know, kind of going back to what we were talking about in the beginning of why having video is important. When you build that human connection, then people want to support you directly. And I think it's easier to make that argument of like, hey guys, you know, as we all know, we're living in crazy times and this could go away tomorrow, or you won't find my content or I could be, I don't know, not, I mean, I guess maybe a shadow ban, but whatever the terms are that are like maybe suppressing your content for the algorithm. 

When you are able to be authentic or share a little bit about this is my creator journey, and if you are in the position where your content creation is your main source of business, then it is a good idea to be thinking about either communicating that to your audience, explaining why it's so important to connect with you on a different platform or on your own website or your email list. So that yeah, you don't get the TikTok danced out from under you.

Lauren: I truly hope no one gets the rug danced out from under them. That would be a terrible way to go.

Chelsea: But if it does, I hope that they're filming it. 

Lauren: Yeah, please. Please be on live while that's happening. 

[39:42]

Lauren: I actually I want to go back to something that you said a little while ago, because I think it's actually kind of an interesting point to make as we're having this conversation. You said that you were a novice with YouTube when you first got started on YouTube. 

Chelsea: Yep. 

Lauren: And I am also spoiler alert, not a podcast expert. 

Chelsea: No.

Lauren: This was a brand new thing to me when Matt first pitched it to me about two years ago. He said, do you want to do a podcast with me? And I said. How? 

Chelsea: Yes, boss. 

Lauren: I mean, technically, I said no first. Which I have reminded him of on this podcast before. But I mean, that was my first question was, I don't know how to do any of that. So I have to learn. 

Chelsea: Yeah. 

Lauren: So you and I have both kind of built these skill sets over our time working on these…

Chelsea: Yeah. 

Lauren: Various different mediums. So I just do want to like, kind of highlight that to anybody that is listening to this and is like, oh, well, you know, you guys are professionals at what you do. 

Chelsea: You guys are so good at this. 

Lauren: Like. Wow. Like, you're so good at what you do. But yeah, I mean, yes, we have the backing of a brand behind us.

Chelsea: Yeah. 

Lauren: So we have like resources available to us and educational resources and financial resources –  

Chelsea: Yes

Lauren: – and things like that. But we did very much both of us kind of built these channels, or are actively building these channels. And it continues to be a learning process every day.

Chelsea: Yeah. 

Lauren: Like, I can't speak for you. You've been doing this longer than I have. 

Chelsea: No, it is.

Lauren: Like, I'm constantly. 

Chelsea: Can confirm. 

Lauren: Yeah. Like learning new things, trying new things, trying to like, find new tools to do things, to make things easier.  

Chelsea: Yeah.

Lauren: Trying to find new ways to connect with audiences.

Chelsea: Yeah.

Lauren: To try different things in episodes. I mean, this is…

Chelsea: Right.

Lauren: This is an episode that's not me and Matt. 

Chelsea: Right right. 

Lauren: We’re trying something new right now. 

Chelsea: Spoiler alert. If you haven't, if that hasn't come through already. 

Lauren: Surprise. That's not Matt you're listening to right now. But so I do, just, know, if you're listening to this and you're like, I, you guys are not the right people to be giving advice about this because I don't…

Chelsea: Yeah. 

Lauren: You're getting paid to do this content that you're creating.

Chelsea: Yeah.

Lauren: No, I think we're actually very qualified. 

Chelsea: Yeah. Super qualified. 

Lauren: Yeah. 

Chelsea: Obviously the most, the most qualified. 

Lauren: Obviously. 

Chelsea: But I mean, but I think, it's just different because if you are doing it yourself, I mean, there's just kind of a different level of pressure. Because being an an ambass for a brand, it can be intimidating. So yeah, there's something that goes into it there. But yeah, just trying it and giving yourself grace and, you know, with our change in the way that we've approached video and even deciding to do a podcast and… All this is still human people that are doing it. And I think that sometimes when you put video content or you put yourself out there online, people just kind of forget or don't believe that you have the full suite of human emotions 

Lauren: Yeah. 

Chelsea. And you can feel scared or discouraged or nervous or whatever. So that is still very much a part of it. And imposter syndrome is very real. I mean, to be honest, we were talking about doing this podcast and I was like, I don't want to talk about video content. Because I don't, even though I've been doing it for a while, there's still so much to learn. And even with the recent shift in how we've started editing our videos or how we're filming them. 

That was just kind of me looking online and thinking, oh, you these channels are doing really well and we can do that too. So I just want to say you have to give yourself grace and, and yeah, everybody goes through the imposter syndrome and you will feel that unless you're maybe you're superhuman and you don't and that's fantastic. But yeah, just trying it. What if you don't? You know, you'll never know. 

Lauren: Yeah.

Chelsea: You just try it. 

Lauren: Yeah. 

Chelsea: Just do it.

Lauren: Try it and – 

Chelsea: get out there.

Lauren: – figure out how to make it work. 

Chelsea: Yeah. And I mean, I was just saying to you before this started, all the things that you've learned putting this podcast together. So it's like, you know, when you go through this, even if at the end of the day, you decide that's not for me, or it's not helping me reach my goals, you have a whole new skill set that you can pull from when you try the next thing. So 

Lauren: Yeah. 

Chelsea: I think the net net is worth it. 

Lauren: Yeah, absolutely. I think that there is so much value in the learning experience on this, and especially something like video content. Because we really have seen, I mean, I think back to Social Mmedia Marketing World in March of 2020, which is already. 

Chelsea: RIP 2020. 

Lauren: Triggering. Truly. It was literally social media marketing world in San Diego in March of 2020 was literally the last thing I did before everything shut down. But five years ago, the main topic of conversation at that conference was how important video was going to be –

Chelsea: Yeah. 

Lauren: – to social media. To social media marketing, to social media engagement, to like anybody, whether it was a massive Fortune 500 company to an individual influencer or brand just trying to make a name for themselves –

Chelsea: Yeah. 

Lauren: – in some way on social media. They could not stop emphasizing how important video was. And we have only seen that grow. 

Chelsea: Right.

Lauren: Over the last five years. 

Chelsea: Right.

Lauren: And it was already important even before that too. YouTube has been just the unstoppable force. 

Chelsea: It's insane. It is insane how much content is on YouTube. 

Lauren: It's like, think about the fact that there was a time where YouTube, there was a time in our lifetime where YouTube wasn't a thing.

Chelsea: I'm 12 years old.

Lauren: You’re right, I'm so sorry. 

Chelsea: Don’t out me.

Lauren: There was a time in my lifetime. Are we the same age? I think we’re the same age. Or close to it. 

Chelsea: Yeah, think so. 

Lauren: Yeah, think so. 

Chelsea: Are you 21? 

Lauren: Yes. And not a day over. 

Chelsea: Same. Same. Same. Yeah, I know. Well, I know I was going to say the point or to your point of the like, yeah, it is only gotten more popular. But I also just want to underscore. But there are so many different ways to do it. 

Lauren: Yes. 

Chelsea: Like you're saying the channels that you like, that don't, that you can't see the face of the creator. It's pretty, I mean, there are channels on YouTube that are just like ambient background noises for ten hours that people listen to when they're studying. Or like there are channels that you can put on–yeah, exactly.

Lauren: All the time. All the time.

Chelsea: I listen to them too. Or content that's like, this is my music for cats. These things literally exist and are doing quite well, so. 

Lauren: Yeah. 

Chelsea: So I mean, think, you know, when you think of video, most people, I would assume, or I think, think, okay, I have to get in front of the camera and do this. But even saying, hey, here's some meditative music, I'm gonna do a writing sprint, come join me. It could look like that. It could be pictures or a slideshow of books that you've been reading with some commentary on it. So there are so many, a myriad of forms that video can take if you're interested in exploring it. 

Lauren: Yeah. Absolutely. And myriad of ways that it can become applicable to your marketing efforts and your brand growth efforts outside of creating video content. 

Chelsea: Yeah. 

Lauren: I think there's a lot of skills that you can learn from doing this. Whether it's, you know, getting better at listening to your audience, getting better at understanding what your audience wants from you. Because you're trying to figure out where those content gaps are when you're creating videos or what resonates with them. It might inform what your next book is about.

Chelsea: Oh yeah.

Lauren: Or it might inform… I mean, even things as simple as two years ago, I was deathly afraid of public speaking. 

Chelsea: Look at you now. 

Lauren: Look at me now. London Book Fair was great, by the way, if you haven't watched that episode.

Chelsea: Oh yeah! I know. Congratulations on that. That's insane to go–not only did you public speak, but you public spoke to an international audience.

Lauren: It was wild. It was actually, that was maybe the worst part of it, was realizing that our American jokes were not landing on the international audience. Sorry. Sorry to you guys. 

Chelsea: Yeah. 

Lauren: But yeah, I mean, we were actively, we were at London Book Fair when Matt asked me if I wanted to go speak at another event later this year by myself without him. 

Chelsea: That's awesome. 

Lauren: And like I didn't even hesitate before saying yes. 

Chelsea: Yes. Good for you. 

Lauren: Which is insane. If you told two years ago Lauren, she would have laughed in your face. So, you know, if that's something, if you're, if you're someone who has listened to our previous episodes and has said, like, I do absolutely see the value in adding public speaking elements to my brand, but I'm really nervous about doing that. Or I watched that really great webinar with Chelsea Chandler. Oh, my God. 

Chelsea: Chelsea Chandler. 

Lauren: Oh my god. Damn.

Chelsea: I’ve morphed into a new person. 

Lauren: Stephanie Chandler and Chelsea. 

Chelsea: Yes. Yes. 

Lauren: If you watch that webinar and listen to the episodes where we talked about that and we're like, yeah, absolutely. Totally seeing the value add in this. But public speaking makes me really nervous. 

Chelsea: Yeah. 

Lauren: Maybe your stepping stone into that is to try creating some video content, doing this where you have the option to edit it.

Chelsea: Yes. 

Lauren: You have the option to rerecord it. You're not live. You're not…like the only audience in front of you is your camera and your cat. 

Chelsea: That's right. That's right. 

Lauren: And maybe that's how you bridge that gap. 

Chelsea: Yeah, you get some reps in and you kind of understand the flow or the cadence or slowing down the way that you talk. Actually, I heard this tip the other day and I thought it was very helpful. Potentially, I haven't tried it yet. But one thing that I have a problem with, I'll talk really fast. 

Lauren: Same. 

Chelsea: Especially when I'm in public, like actually public speaking, I will just start talking really, really fast and I have to kind of take a beat. And so I was reading a newsletter and the guy was like, you, when you're preparing for a talk, you should do some light cardio when you're doing it so that you can, your body can adjust to like, the heightened excitement or nerves that you'll have when you go in front of an audience. 

Lauren: Huh.

Chelsea: And so–I know–so I have not tried that yet, but if you are thinking, or if you have a speaking event coming up and this happens to you, then try to jog a little bit and practice your talk. And so that when you go to it, your body's already kind of in that, or used to being in that state, so it doesn't hit you as hard. And then you can try that out. And I would also say that I've heard that your brain registers like, excitement and nervousness as the same thing. So then kind of trying to do some self-talk and be like, I'm excited about this instead of being like, oh my gosh, oh my gosh, or trying to imagine everybody's naked or whatever. 

Then, you know, just be like, I'm excited. I'm happy to be here. I know it goes back to adding value. I know I'm going to help. And that people that they're in this audience are going to be getting a good message that's actionable and helpful and then see if that works out. 

Lauren: There's always – 

Chelsea: And then go sprint up some stairs. Before, after, or during the talk. Make your audience come with you.

Lauren: During. 

Chelsea: Yeah, during. 

Lauren: During, preferably. My personal favorite was, shout out to Robbie Fitzwater, who reminded me. 

Chelsea: Rock and roll.

Lauren: Rock and roll. For sure. Who reminded me that I should listen to some really good hype music. 

Chelsea: Oh yeah. 

Lauren: Right before. Which unfortunately, Robbie, I was not able to take that advice because it was a little bit of a whirlwind. 

Chelsea: Because you were in London and they're boring. 

Lauren: But I did–well. But I did think about that advice as I was getting ready. So, I appreciate it. For sure. 

Chelsea: You're going through Taylor Swift's discography in your mind. 

Lauren: Actual fun fact about your tip just right there. One of the things that she did to get ready for the Eras tour was she would run, jog or walk on the treadmill for the full length of her set list while singing through her set list. 

Chelsea: Oh my gosh, that's insane. 

Lauren: Which is a three and a half hour show. 

Chelsea: Oh my gosh.

Lauren: So that means that she did a three and a half hour treadmill workout as her regular training routine and was singing while on the treadmill. So shout out to my girl. 

Chelsea: Well, you know what? I think that if you want to hit Taylor Swift levels of success, if that's the kind of person you are, then I guess take that advice. But she's obviously doing something right. 

Lauren: Yeah. Don't knock it til you try it, I guess. 

Chelsea: Buy a treadmill. 

Lauren: It’s fine. 

Chelsea: It's fine. 

Lauren: Whatever. 

[51:09]

Lauren: Do you have any last parting wisdom or anything that you want to share? Whether it's about shaking off nerves or an action tip for go try this right now, like while you're thinking about it or or just like and subscribe?

Chelsea: Always like and subscribe, even though I said those metrics don't matter to me and I'm above–no, like and subscribe. But yeah, I mean, I think the most important thing is just give yourself a chance. And you may love it and you may decide that it's not for you, but give yourself a chance, and give your audience a chance to see that side of you and to connect with you and have that conversation and that community, and you may end up liking it. 

And even if you know, like I said, if you go through it and you think this is not for me, it could spur more ideas for you that could be your new content. Why I'm not making video content, how I got over my nerves to make video content. Maybe you could get embroiled in controversy and make an apology video, those are super hot right now. So I mean, I just, think, you know, If you feel compelled at all to try it, then I think there's something in you that's saying that you can and you should. 

And yeah, it can just be a phone. Like it doesn't have to be anything crazy. It can just be taking a video on your phone, sharing, you know, whatever you feel is appropriate or it's going to help your audience. And I just think if that is kind of your guidance I think this will be helpful and it will reach the right people. Then, you know, you can't.. if you fail, you'll only fail forward. So. Try it. 

Lauren: I love that. 

Chelsea: Yeah.

Lauren: I think that's a great note to end on. 

Chelsea: Clip it.

Lauren: Got it. Perfect. Thanks for all these great sound bites. 

Chelsea: Yeah.

Lauren: It's gonna be really easy to make the content for this episode. 

Chelsea: Great. 

Lauren: Awesome. 

Chelsea: It'd be terrible if this all got scrapped. I did such a bad job on this podcast it couldn't even see the light of day. 

Lauren: The lost episode. There is a lost episode of this podcast. 

Chelsea: Oh, really? 

Lauren: Yeah. 

Chelsea: Is it–what?

Lauren: There was one that we recorded that we didn't have the soundboard for because I had to send it to Rode for them to fix something on it. 

Chelsea: Yeah?

Lauren: And we didn't get it back in time and it was actually a really good episode but the audio sucked on it, so. 

Chelsea: Yeah, well of course you're gonna say that. You’re not gonna be like it was terrible.

Lauren: I know

Chelsea: It was actually the best episode that we ever did. 

Lauren: It really was. It was the best episode we've ever done. And you guys will never hear it now. Oh well. So sad. 

Chelsea: Well, that's too bad. But yeah, just go out and do it. Go out and try it. I wish you all the best of luck. All the likes, all those subscribes. And yeah, I mean obviously leave us comments and questions if you do have any, any questions about that and I will be happy to help. It's just us looking at them. 

Lauren: Yeah. 

Chelsea: So come on down. 

Lauren: Yeah. If you have questions about anything we talked about here, you can comment on YouTube. Chelsea and I are going to be the ones that see them, so. 

Chelsea: That's right. That's right. 

Lauren: Definitely leave us those comments there. You can email us at podcast@lulu.com. Chelsea does not get those emails. 

Chelsea: I don’t. 

Lauren: But I do. 

Chelsea: I don't. 

Lauren: And I will forward them to her. 

Chelsea: Okay. 

Lauren: We're also definitely going to have her back on again. So if you have a questions

Chelsea: Would love to. 

Lauren: Yeah, it's going to be great. If you have questions about this or anything else that you want to talk to us about, 

Chelsea: Hit us up.

Lauren: Reach out, let us know. 

Chelsea: Let us know. Yeah. 

Lauren: But in the meantime, thanks for listening. See you next week. 

Chelsea: See you later. 

Lauren: And like and subscribe. 

Chelsea: Like and subscribe. Check out our other content. Thanks, everybody. Thank you, Lauren. 

Lauren: Thank you, Chelsea. Bye.

Chelsea: Bye.